“Record of private sector in education has also not been exactly glorious.”

Do you agree to it now?

As an economist, I understand terms like efficiency, optimality, incentives, etc., but the word glorious seems to be not in my glossary

If the goal were universal (elementary) education, I don’t think the private sector/market alone can accomplish this, without any form of assistance from the state. After all, education is costly to supply, and therefore there’s a price at which the market for elementary education would clear. There is no guarantee that at this price, every child can afford to “consume” education. If universal education were the desired goal, the state must step in to fund this goal. There, I reinvented the voucher system!

Any state intervention in education beyond this would be inefficient.

>>If at all, market has failed even more miserably than state in addressing elementary education imbroglio.

>Do you have any data to substantiate this assertion?

>I am not denying the possibility of a market failure here, but to assert that the state is doing a better job is a leap of faith. It’s difficult to write all I would like to on this in a comment, but let me make an attempt.

OK. Let me take back my statement and modify:

“Record of private sector in education has also not been exactly glorious.”

Do you agree to it now?

Now if you have read Atanu’s series on education, you would have noticed that again and again he comes back on this thme that unshackle the education sector from state control and market will take care of the rest. The point is where are those state shackles in primary education? This sector is already a free for all. Go ahead and open as many private schools as you like. No body is going to restrain you. Yet the same argument is repeated by Atanu every time that all we need is to unshakle the education sector from government control. Many commentators here have pointed out on several occasions that there are practically no state controls on primary and secondary education. However, without addressing those objections, the earlier claims have been repeated here again. It is as if an argument is lifted from from an economic textbook and applied here without bothering to check if these conditions really apply in India. Atanu has so far been silent on what state controls he finds in primary and secondary education that need to be lifted. If you look closely, you will hardly find any. However since economists agree that freeing primary education from state control is the solution then that MUST be accepted as THE solution, regardless of the fact whether there are any state conrols or not.

Repeating something over and over again does not make it an argument. That’s why I had requested Atanu to go through some of the objections raised on this topic earlier and address them as they apply to India.

~Manish Saxena

My reason for mentioning that article was the high literacy rate of Kerala – which stands out among Indian states. I came across it, read it, it made sense, I found it interesting and hence I mentioned it. The focus was education and literacy, and not life expectancy. I’m not qualified enough to tell what part of that article is truth and what’s false (that’s what discussion is for), and I’m sure there are aspects of that article – as well as *reasons* for Kerala’s literacy rate – that are open for debate and discussion.

taran_72,
If you see atanu’s (and many other plans)
the end goal is not to tell others what the qualification to entrance should be…
But the fundamental question that Dey and others are trying to address is,
Lets assume there’s a demand to learn skills, how is/isn’t that demand being fulfilled ?

My position differs a significantly on basic assumption, but not necessarily on routes .

@Amit the Asha fan
stop dontating to asha, I say that as a former donor to asha, i dont buy in their BailGobar.
First lets pick on why did the intentialy ambigous North American Male shows up all the time in their crap docs/ In case you are too damn lazy… US life is ~80(including HUGE IMMIGRANT FLOWS).

Even today, who stops people from opening schools; hospitals in villages? I have not seen any improvement in my native place which is a taluka headquater in last 35 years. Even today, people need to rely on State Transport buses to go to nearby villages.

I have some other opinion on reservation. First of all, these institutions are run by public money. And i totally disagree the way talent is measured in India. It completely favors students studying in cities and whose parents can afford coaching classes. How many students from village schools even make it to IIT/IIM? Do you think they are not talented? Can’t they be given some extra training and make equal? I totally disagree with caste based reservation but i strongly support giving few extra points to students from villages, municipal schools etc while preparing merit lists?

I am sure India as a whole still negotiate with developed counties on pollution norms, child labor etc based on the argument that we are still developing country and can not accept developed world standards so soon. Can’t we use the same argument for reservation within our country?

I do not have hope that government will take proactive action in the next decade (unless we have sensible chief ministers) who drive education. Politicians have strong incentives to maintain status-quo.

Most Indians settle to the thought of fate for everything not happening the right way and do not even attempt to raise the voice / solve the problem when governments do not deliver.

Unless this attitude changes, improvements will be slow and could take long long time.

My only hope is private educational institutions, philantraphists and charity organizations could make a difference in primary and secondary education.

Back of the envelope calculation reveals the cost per student to be in the range of Rs 5000 – 10000 per year for quality education. This could be brought down further with innovative use of technologies.

We need a renaissance movement to substantially improve education, living environment, basic amenities, etc.

What is the status of your education initiative?

If at all, market has failed even more miserably than state in addressing elementary education imbroglio.

Do you have any data to substantiate this assertion?

I am not denying the possibility of a market failure here, but to assert that the state is doing a better job is a leap of faith. It’s difficult to write all I would like to on this in a comment, but let me make an attempt.

For starters, there is imperfect information on the quality of the education offered by the schools, private or public. The effects of this on the market for elementary education includes price and quality dispersion. Achieving uniformity across the board is impossible, and may not be desirable either.

Think about the process that the parents go through in searching for and selecting a school for their children. This is costly, and the costs would vary across the parents. Some parents will be more willing to bear higher costs for information than others. Some will be able to get better information at a lower cost. In the extremes we will have informed and uninformed parents, and the market will be segmented accordingly into good and bad schools. These segments will include public schools, too. There is extensive literature on this subject, and not restricted to the market of elementary education . To begin with, read J. E. Stiglitz. “Equilibrium in Product Markets with Imperfect Information”, The American Economic Review, Vol. 69, No. 2, Papers and Proceedings of the Ninety-First Annual Meeting of the American Economic Association (May, 1979), pp. 339-345.

I must add that quota/reservations will adversely impact the market for elementary education by reducing the incentives to get information on the school, leading to more lemons. After all, what do I care what sort of elementary or high school education my child gets, if I could get her into the IIT on the basis of the caste she inherited from me?

I am raising here a point, which has been raised earlier by many commentators on this forum but never got addressed by you.

No doubt our elementary education is in a mess. However, it is wrong to say that elementary education is shackled by state. Pretty much anyone can and does open a private elementary school in India. For example, criteria for getting a government recognition for a private elementary school in UP are ridiculously low. All you need is a 240 sqm area, a blackboard, a High School pass teacher and you are all set. Moreover, there is no need for you to get even a registration if you have less than 100 students. There are absolutely no safeguards to prevent you from charging extortionary fees for most horrendous quality of education. Elementary education sector is a dream world for a free marketer.

Per your logic, this situation should have long been cured by the invisible hand of market. However, in practice we don’t see this happening. If at all, market has failed even more miserably than state in addressing elementary education imbroglio.